Need 10 watts per each MHs produced

cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
edited February 2018 in Mining
Do you agree (check on your riggers setup) that, for each MHs your riggers is producing, you need power in the range 8 to 10 watts ?

Examples:

6x AMD RX580 = 180 MHs will require 1500 to 1800w PSU
6x Nvidia1060 = 140 MHs will require 1100 to 1400w PSU

(Considering 80% as limit to protect long life your PSU)
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Comments

  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    Your values are unoptimized.
    6x Nvidia1060 could run on 600W
    6x AMD RX580 could run on 750W

    So the 8-10W/MHs rate is bad, only reasonable for R9 390 or Fury cards, newer gpus are much more effective.
  • asusrigasusrig Member Posts: 141
    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:

    Your values are unoptimized.
    6x Nvidia1060 could run on 600W
    6x AMD RX580 could run on 750W

    So the 8-10W/MHs rate is bad, only reasonable for R9 390 or Fury cards, newer gpus are much more effective.

    I noted you writing "could run on" but question is are you running 6x Nvidia 1060 hashing 140MHs (or above) on 600w?

    hmmm... let's wait your answer

  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?
  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2018
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    Your values are unoptimized.
    6x Nvidia1060 could run on 600W
    6x AMD RX580 could run on 750W

    So the 8-10W/MHs rate is bad, only reasonable for R9 390 or Fury cards, newer gpus are much more effective.

    I noted you writing "could run on" but question is are you running 6x Nvidia 1060 hashing 140MHs (or above) on 600w?

    hmmm... let's wait your answer

    I don't have any 1060, but i do have 6x580 rig running 180MH/s on <700W. I've read a lot about the 1060 and others even write [email protected]<80W, which i can't confirm, so i said a reasonable average.

  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?

    You can calculate by the given numbers, 60w for base system + 6x94w = 624w which is quite good (i even think it's a bit overstatement or not measured at the wall), my target number for 1070ti is just 120-130w (850w for 6x1070ti rig), if i set powerlimit near to 100w, it crashes instantly, but haven't experimented much.
  • cidmocidmo Member Posts: 446 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2018
    depending on which 1070ti u got (i think only the amp and kingpin are diff, 2x 8pins)
    a friend from MSI said that pretty much all 1070ti have best efficiency at 65% PL
    this has to do with the sensors
    the amp and kingpin are designed for LN2
    i run mine around 65% -400 core max OC mem and get 31Mh on all of em at approx 110watts
    i only have MSI 1070ti tho and can confirm this is the case for them
    my 1x EVGA 1070 is way different tho
    not really sure how ppl are getting under 100 watts at 32Mh tho
    everytime i run that high im nearing 150watts
  • asusrigasusrig Member Posts: 141
    edited February 2018
    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?
    I have RX580 cards also.

    6 x RX580: 31.6 mh/s @ 865 watts per UPS for cards only and 5 case fans
    7 x 1070 ti: 32.5 mh/s @ 865 watts per UPS for cards, CPU, RAM, SSD and 5 case fans

    The 5 case fans use about 17 watts. So by my calculation the six RX580 cards are consuming about 848 watts.

    848 / 6 = 141.33 watts average per card (not counting loss due to inefficiency of PSU)

    That comes to 4.47 watts per mh/s for RX580 cards.

    At the wall the reading is 910 watts for one rig. So 910 watts - 20 watts for case fans = 890 watts @ 190 mh/s for 6 RX580 cards.

    That comes to 4.68 watts per mh/s for RX580 cards (PSU inefficiency factored).
  • asusrigasusrig Member Posts: 141
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    Your values are unoptimized.
    6x Nvidia1060 could run on 600W
    6x AMD RX580 could run on 750W

    So the 8-10W/MHs rate is bad, only reasonable for R9 390 or Fury cards, newer gpus are much more effective.

    I noted you writing "could run on" but question is are you running 6x Nvidia 1060 hashing 140MHs (or above) on 600w?

    hmmm... let's wait your answer

    I don't have any 1060, but i do have 6x580 rig running 180MH/s on
    How are you calculating the watts? With a meter at the outlet or via a UPS monitor? If you go by HWinfo or other software monitoring software it is not accurate. You need to measure it with a UPS and also check the wattage at the wall.
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    edited February 2018
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    Your values are unoptimized.
    6x Nvidia1060 could run on 600W
    6x AMD RX580 could run on 750W

    So the 8-10W/MHs rate is bad, only reasonable for R9 390 or Fury cards, newer gpus are much more effective.

    I noted you writing "could run on" but question is are you running 6x Nvidia 1060 hashing 140MHs (or above) on 600w?

    hmmm... let's wait your answer

    I don't have any 1060, but i do have 6x580 rig running 180MH/s on
    Okay, I admit my first post is not clear enough.

    My question is not how many watts you pushing from the wall socket. My question is when you assigning/selecting a PSU to your mining rig the rule of thumb is "10w for each Mhs produced"

    P.S. that is why my first post referring 80% as limit to protect the PSUs

    You might be pulling <700w from wall socket (seems very very low for an overclocked RX580) but I would like to know which PSU solution you assigned to that Rig (I also have several rigs on RX580)

  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?

    You can calculate by the given numbers, 60w for base system + 6x94w = 624w which is quite good (i even think it's a bit overstatement or not measured at the wall), my target number for 1070ti is just 120-130w (850w for 6x1070ti rig), if i set powerlimit near to 100w, it crashes instantly, but haven't experimented much.
    Can you kindly share what is your PSU solution for that rig of 6x1070i running overclocked?
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    edited February 2018
    asusrig said:

    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?
    I have RX580 cards also.

    6 x RX580: 31.6 mh/s @ 865 watts per UPS for cards only and 5 case fans
    7 x 1070 ti: 32.5 mh/s @ 865 watts per UPS for cards, CPU, RAM, SSD and 5 case fans

    The 5 case fans use about 17 watts. So by my calculation the six RX580 cards are consuming about 848 watts.

    848 / 6 = 141.33 watts average per card (not counting loss due to inefficiency of PSU)

    That comes to 4.47 watts per mh/s for RX580 cards.

    At the wall the reading is 910 watts for one rig. So 910 watts - 20 watts for case fans = 890 watts @ 190 mh/s for 6 RX580 cards.

    That comes to 4.68 watts per mh/s for RX580 cards (PSU inefficiency factored).
    asusrig, many thanks for your answer. It has lots useful information.

    I took note of your number 4.47 ~ 5w per MHs produced

    But that number 5 is for "power usage from wall socket". I was asking about your PSU total capacity installed divided by yours 190MHs production (by the way congratulations on 190 on 6xRX580, I adjusted my 6xRX580 to only 180)

    What I keep saying is that for a mining rig (let's say an average 6xGPU rig) the "rule of thumb" is to assign 8-10w PSU capacity per each MHs produced (assuming we all want to run our rigs overclocked as my 2 examples in first post).



  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    If I could do it I would change the title of this post from original:

    "Need 10 watts per each MHs produced"

    to a more correct one (sorry my bad English):

    "Your Rig will need PSU capacity of 8-10 watts per each MHs produced"

    I tried to change it but I think is not possible
  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?

    You can calculate by the given numbers, 60w for base system + 6x94w = 624w which is quite good (i even think it's a bit overstatement or not measured at the wall), my target number for 1070ti is just 120-130w (850w for 6x1070ti rig), if i set powerlimit near to 100w, it crashes instantly, but haven't experimented much.
    Can you kindly share what is your PSU solution for that rig of 6x1070i running overclocked?
    For that rig, i'm using this: http://www.chieftec.eu/en/psus/odm-psu/navitas-series-odm/gpm-1250c.html
    Not because this is some super psu, rather i couldn't buy any other 1000W+. (but i have 5 of these and all works great)

    For the rule of thumb:
    Watts doesn't mean the number your chasing (5V+3.3V rails are also included in that number). I calculate the Ampers needed on 12V for my setup, and choose psu based on supplied Amps on 12V (single/multi rail setup is also important).
  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2018
    cjclm7 said:


    You might be pulling 700w from wall socket (seems very very low for an overclocked RX580)

    That's not very very low, my results is even weak, compared to Wolf0's and others.
    Research polaris gpu bios voltage offset, that's the key for really low consumption.

  • asusrigasusrig Member Posts: 141
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:


    You might be pulling 700w from wall socket (seems very very low for an overclocked RX580)

    That's not very very low, my results is even weak, compared to Wolf0's and others.
    Research polaris gpu bios voltage offset, that's the key for really low consumption.

    Would you mind posting a screenshot of hwinfo showing the power usage of your RX580 cards? Here is a screenshot of a RX580 and 1070 TI side by side in two of my rigs. Note how power is reported differently for the 1070 ti and RX580. There are more power entries for the RX580. Not sure if the numbers should be added up but I do know my six cards are using around 848 watts per UPS reading (865 watts if 5 case fans are included).


  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:

    asusrig said:

    These numbers are way off. I am getting 32.5 MH/s with 1070 ti cards and they are using around 94 watts. So that is under 3 watts per MH/s.

    I would never even consider mining if the cards were that inefficient. And the heat would be a killer.

    I do not own a 1070 so I did not use that example on my first post but since you own one and you hashing at 32.5MHs then can you share with us how much PSU power a rig of 6x 1070 needs to hash 6x32.5=195MHs ?

    You can calculate by the given numbers, 60w for base system + 6x94w = 624w which is quite good (i even think it's a bit overstatement or not measured at the wall), my target number for 1070ti is just 120-130w (850w for 6x1070ti rig), if i set powerlimit near to 100w, it crashes instantly, but haven't experimented much.
    Can you kindly share what is your PSU solution for that rig of 6x1070i running overclocked?
    For that rig, i'm using this: http://www.chieftec.eu/en/psus/odm-psu/navitas-series-odm/gpm-1250c.html
    Not because this is some super psu, rather i couldn't buy any other 1000W+. (but i have 5 of these and all works great)

    For the rule of thumb:
    Watts doesn't mean the number your chasing (5V+3.3V rails are also included in that number). I calculate the Ampers needed on 12V for my setup, and choose psu based on supplied Amps on 12V (single/multi rail setup is also important).
    Okay, I noted you assigned a 1250w PSU for your 6x1070i rig. How much are you hashing with that rig?
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:


    You might be pulling 700w from wall socket (seems very very low for an overclocked RX580)

    That's not very very low, my results is even weak, compared to Wolf0's and others.
    Research polaris gpu bios voltage offset, that's the key for really low consumption.

    Okay then what is your PSU solution assigned to that rig 6x580 of yours?
  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:

    cjclm7 said:


    You might be pulling 700w from wall socket (seems very very low for an overclocked RX580)

    That's not very very low, my results is even weak, compared to Wolf0's and others.
    Research polaris gpu bios voltage offset, that's the key for really low consumption.

    Okay then what is your PSU solution assigned to that rig 6x580 of yours?
    I'm using a 2kWatt PSU for that rig, not because it's needed, rather i had this in excess. I have many rigs and hardware, not all of my rigs are optimized for cheapness.
    cjclm7 said:


    Okay, I noted you assigned a 1250w PSU for your 6x1070i rig. How much are you hashing with that rig?

    182MH/s ETH + ~3GH/s PASC
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:



    I'm using a 2kWatt PSU for that rig, not because it's needed, rather i had this in excess. I have many rigs and hardware, not all of my rigs are optimized for cheapness.

    Okay then I rest my case here: 2000w PSU capacity assigned to a 6xRX580 rig producing 190MHs (10W per MHs)

    (also not saying you need it but fact is the rule 8-10W PSU capacity assigned to an OC rig remains valid in your case also)

  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:



    I'm using a 2kWatt PSU for that rig, not because it's needed, rather i had this in excess. I have many rigs and hardware, not all of my rigs are optimized for cheapness.

    Okay then I rest my case here: 2000w PSU capacity assigned to a 6xRX580 rig producing 190MHs (10W per MHs)

    (also not saying you need it but fact is the rule 8-10W PSU capacity assigned to an OC rig remains valid in your case also)

    Your conclusion is flawed, but do what you want. :)
    I have 6x390 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x470 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x1070 hashing 180MH/[email protected] Ampers on 12V is what matters . I can't explain better why MHs/W rule is pointless. :)
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    edited February 2018
    rmh said:

    <
    Okay, I noted you assigned a 1250w PSU for your 6x1070i rig. How much are you hashing with that rig?

    182MH/s ETH + ~3GH/s PASC

    okay, here you having a ~ 7W assigned PSU capacity for each MHs produced (not in range 8-10W but close)

  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    rmh said:



    Your conclusion is flawed, but do what you want. :)
    I have 6x390 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x470 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x1070 hashing 180MH/[email protected] Ampers on 12V is what matters . I can't explain better why MHs/W rule is pointless. :)


    When a new miner is considering the choice of PSU to assign to his new rigger this rule (choose PSU capacity within range 8-10W per each MHs you target to produce) this might be useful and not "pointless".

  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:



    Your conclusion is flawed, but do what you want. :)
    I have 6x390 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x470 rig hashing 175MH/[email protected], 6x1070 hashing 180MH/[email protected] Ampers on 12V is what matters . I can't explain better why MHs/W rule is pointless. :)


    When a new miner is considering the choice of PSU to assign to his new rigger this rule (choose PSU capacity within range 8-10W per each MHs you target to produce) this might be useful and not "pointless".

    It's a nonsense and fucking pointless, like i said, PSU Watts is a summed showwindow number, so what matters is Ampers. And You shouldn't calculate by hashrate, rather power consumption, because there's gpus which hashing [email protected](25A 12V) and which hasing [email protected](8,5A 12V).
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    yeah... that might be but after all your (hard) talk, in the end you also assigned PSU to your riggers respecting that rule...
  • rmhrmh Member Posts: 410 ✭✭✭
    cjclm7 said:

    yeah... that might be but after all your (hard) talk, in the end you also assigned PSU to your riggers respecting that rule...

    You really read that i'm respecting that rule, because i said that ONE of my rigs have 2000W PSU for 700W consumption?
    All of the commenters said, your calculation is flawed.
    So sorry for hard talk, but i'm annoyed when talking to deaf ears. I do not care to persuade you, I wanted to help you because you wrote stupid things, but do what you want, i'm done with this topic.
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    edited February 2018
    rmh said:


    (...)
    All of the commenters said, your calculation is flawed.

    really only 3 "commenters" so far and only you said calculation is "flawed".

    If do believe other Community members sharing their rig's PSU/MHS ratio we would find it withing range 8-10W per MHs
    rmh said:


    So sorry for hard talk, but i'm annoyed when talking to deaf ears. I do not care to persuade you, I wanted to help you because you wrote stupid things, but do what you want, i'm done with this topic.

    thanks for your educated contribution

  • LippyCKLippyCK Member Posts: 24
    cjclm7 said:

    rmh said:


    (...)
    All of the commenters said, your calculation is flawed.

    really only 3 "commenters" so far and only you said calculation is "flawed".

    If do believe other Community members sharing their rig's PSU/MHS ratio we would find it withing range 8-10W per MHs
    rmh said:


    So sorry for hard talk, but i'm annoyed when talking to deaf ears. I do not care to persuade you, I wanted to help you because you wrote stupid things, but do what you want, i'm done with this topic.

    thanks for your educated contribution

    Here is 4th that will tell you your calculation is flawed

    If you have 5x r9 295x2 you will hash around 220Mhs and you will use 2500w just for cards, and that has to be 2500W on 12V rail not just on your PSU cos 1200W PSU can give you roughly 1000W on 12V and 200w on 5V and 3.3V. So to run that you will needed 2x 1500w range PSU.

    If you run 5xgtx 1070 you will hash around 150 MHs and you will use around 550W just for cards so you can get away with good 650W PSU which is much lower than your calculations.

    There is no rule of thumb here.
    It all depends on how efficient cards you plan to run and how high quality PSU you wanna buy.
    650W 80+ platinum rated high quality PSU will get away with 5x1070 if you optimize them right, but 650W noname PSU without any certificate wont run them.

    I have R9380x and 3x r7 370 which are by todays standards quite inefficient cards runing on Corsair CX650 PSU which is only 80+bronze and whole rig pulls 600w from wall and it runs without any problems, if i change it for 700W LC power office no certificate psu it crashes in few min after i start miner and it try to pull 650W from wall. Those 50W extra are because that PSU is not efficient as CX650 and it crashes because it cant provide that much power on 12V rail.






  • mchu3599mchu3599 Member Posts: 29
    Here is what I have:

    7 MSI Armor RX580 8GB
    1 Sapphire Nitro+ RX570 8GB

    Total hash rate 225Mh/s

    Total power (including M/B and monitor): 1065W

    So just a hair below 5W/MH/s
  • cjclm7cjclm7 Member Posts: 77
    mchu3599 said:

    Here is what I have:

    7 MSI Armor RX580 8GB
    1 Sapphire Nitro+ RX570 8GB

    Total hash rate 225Mh/s

    Total power (including M/B and monitor): 1065W

    So just a hair below 5W/MH/s

    What is the PSU you using?
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